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Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Should MOS:US (WP:Manual of Style#US and U.S.):
00:51, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
The central matter is whether "US" or "U.S." is the dominant spelling in current (not historical) North American English, across all style guides and reliable sources (i.e., not limited to a particular genre or field). The previous discussion involved detailed source review to answer this question. The current version, based in MOS:COMMONALITY without citing it, relies on "US" being demonstrably dominant; so does the (reverted) newest version, explicit about COMMONALITY; while the MOS:ENGVAR idea suggested in the old version depends on the opposite (ENGVAR only applies to a consistently dominant usage in a country).
The issue raised, for editing, is this: the current version gradually favors "US" over time, and the newest version does so more explicitly, while the old version would keep "U.S." indefinitely in most articles that use it.
Current version (dates to mid-2010s): |
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In American and Canadian English, as elsewhere, US has become the dominant abbreviation for United States. However, U.S. (with periods [full points] and without a space) remains common in North American publications, especially in news journalism. At least one major American style guide, The Chicago Manual of Style (since 2010), now deprecates "U.S." and recommends "US". Because use of periods for abbreviations and acronyms should be consistent within any given article, use US in an article with other country abbreviations, and especially avoid constructions like the U.S., UK, and USSR. In longer abbreviations (three letters or more) that incorporate the country's initials (USN, USAF), do not use periods. When the United States is mentioned with one or more other countries in the same sentence, U.S. or US may be too informal, especially at the first mention or as a noun instead of an adjective (France and the United States, not France and the U.S.). Do not use the spaced U. S. or the archaic U.S. of A., except when quoting. Do not use U.S.A. or USA except in a quotation, as part of a proper name (Team USA), or in certain technical/formal uses (e.g., the ISO 3166-1 alpha-3 codes and FIFA country codes). |
Newest version (2017): |
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US is a commonly used abbreviation for United States, although U.S. – with periods and without a space – remains common in North American publications, including in news journalism. Multiple American style guides, including The Chicago Manual of Style (since 2010), now deprecate "U.S." and recommend "US". For commonality reasons, use US by default when abbreviating, but retain U.S. in American or Canadian English articles in which it is already established, unless there is a good reason to change it. Because use of periods for abbreviations and acronyms should be consistent within any given article, use US in an article with other country abbreviations, and especially avoid constructions like the U.S. and the UK. In longer abbreviations that incorporate the country's initials (USN, USAF), never use periods. When the United States is mentioned with one or more other countries in the same sentence, US (or U.S.) may be too informal, especially at the first mention or as a noun instead of an adjective (France and the United States, not France and the US). Do not use the spaced U. S. or the archaic U.S. of A., except when quoting. Do not use U.S.A. or USA except in a quotation, as part of a proper name (Team USA), or in certain technical and formal uses (e.g., the ISO 3166-1 alpha-3, FIFA, and IOC country codes). |
Early version (early 2010s): |
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In American and Canadian English, U.S. (with periods [full stops] and without a space) is the dominant abbreviation for United States, though at least one major American style guide, The Chicago Manual of Style (16th ed.), now deprecates U.S. and prefers US (without periods). US is more common in most other national forms of English. Use of periods for abbreviations and acronyms should be consistent within any given article and congruent with the variety of English used by that article. In longer abbreviations (three letters or more) that incorporate the country's initials (USN, USAF), do not use periods. When the United States is mentioned with one or more other countries in the same sentence, U.S. or US may be too informal, especially at the first mention or as a noun instead of an adjective (France and the United States, not France and the U.S.). Do not use the spaced U. S. or the archaic U.S. of A., except when quoting. Do not use U.S.A. or USA except in a quotation, as part of a proper name (Team USA), or in certain technical/formal uses (e.g., the ISO 3166-1 alpha-3 codes and FIFA country codes). |
Please avoid empty WP:ILIKEIT / WP:IKNOWIT comments, as well as wikipolitical arguments about why we have/shouldn't have a style guide, whether a wikiproject should/shouldn't "own" articles in its scope, etc. Please stay on-topic.
This is a procedural RfC suggested by someone else, though dispute since the 2017 change has been minimal. A footnote about inconsistent journalistic usage was elided from the current-version and newest-version copies above, for brevity. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 00:51, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
No preference version |
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US and U.S. are commonly-used abbreviations for United States. U.S. – with periods and without a space – remains common in North American publications, including all works of the United States government and in news media, while US is more often used elsewhere.
US should always be used in tables where other ISO 3166-1 alpha-2 two-letter country codes are in use. Longer abbreviations that incorporate the country's initials (USN, USAF) never use periods, but partial constructions like U.S. Navy and U.S. Air Force may. Do not use the spaced U. S. or the archaic U.S. of A., except when quoting. Do not use U.S.A. or USA except in a quotation, as part of a proper name (Team USA), or in certain technical and formal uses (e.g., the ISO 3166-1 alpha-3, FIFA, and IOC country codes). |
Well if this RFC is actually going forward limited to only handling of US/U.S., here is the version I suggest, which does not prescriptively prohibit either style, but gives guidance to avoid the abbreviation for commonality. It recognizes that both dotted and undotted are commonly-used and acceptable, and that neither is a default nor forbidden. This will prevent edit warring and also prevent editors from being sanctioned for following a style they've know their whole lives. I intend to present an expanded form of this sometime in the future to cover other geographical acronyms (like Canadian English frequent use of dotted geographical acronyms like P.E.I., B.C., etc.). -- Netoholic @ 04:56, 7 July 2018 (UTC)
RS citations, with direct quotes (and analysis by SMcCandlish): |
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I'll get this started, using the stack of style guides closest to my desk (leaves out some stuff like Scientific Style and Format):
This is just a start, though it took several hours and I'd rather not do more unless really necessary.
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— SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 01:29, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
Thread in response to Netoholic's objection relocated here to keep the comment section un-mired.
Moving on: there is no ongoing dispute about "UK" vs. "U.K.", etc. This has been covered by MOS:ABBR for over a decade without strife or contention. There's a very stable site-wide consensus to present acronyms/initialisms in "UK, HIV/AIDS, USAF, and UNICEF" format, not "U.K., H.I.V./A.I.D.S., U.S.A.F. [even the USAF doesn't!], and U.N.I.C.E.F." format (nor in daft journalese like "Aids and Unicef"). There is no open question about this, only about "U.S.", because some Americans doggedly insist on this mid-20th-centuryism despite proof that it's no longer dominant usage even in American publishing. And just because the "P.E.I." style exists at all doesn't mean it should be used here instead of "PEI". It is not an ENGVAR matter, since there is no nationwide consistent norm to use that style anywhere in the anglosphere any longer. — SMcCandlish — an American — ☏ ¢ 😼 06:48, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
Update: The Chicago Manual of Style 17th ed. (2017) wasn't included in the original source run (I didn't have it yet at the time). Despite Netoholic's strange claims to the contrary [8][9], it's almost word-for-word identical to the advice in the 16th ed., never even mentioning "U.S." except in the context of old-style envelope addresses using traditional state abbreviations ("Mass., U.S.", "Calif., U.S."). Here's the full relevant text:
The Chicago Manual of Style, 17th ed. (2017), University of Chicago Press, ISBN: 9780226287058 |
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I skipped 10.27 (US states and territories) because it gives the same advice (two-letter postal codes, no dots) as 10.4 and 10.28. This is the same advice as in the 16th ed. (2010), aside from a few copyediting tweaks, and the new "In a departure" note, quoted above. |
— SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 09:00, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
History-wise (and without getting into dramaboard-style diffs), what I see is a bold change (mine) led to a long consensus discussion last year. The resulting version (refined from bold one) was stable after that. No one seemed to care. An editor, irked by a mass change to "enforce" that version (which should have been taken to ANI as a WP:MEATBOT matter) showed up and boldly started rewriting it radically without discussion; someone reverted that; rewriter then tit-for-tat reverted to an older version closer to their preferences. Only one editor appears to have edit-warred and short of 3RR, just 2, to get rid of the newest of these three drafts, after someone already objected to their removal the first time. Only then did discussion ensue, but with the revising bold editor complaining about how bold the previous version was (even though it was really the product of a consensus discussion), and wanting an RfC. But then that discussion turned circular with extraneous stuff that's basically a challenge to the existence of MOS:ABBR. I opened the RfC on the narrower question, since we generally don't nuke entire guideline pages.
The one who wanted the RfC is upset that their particular (basically off-topic) issues aren't addressed by the RfC but I don't think they can be. The way to try to get rid of WP having a preference for "UNESCO on HIV/AIDS in the UK" style, to permit "U.N.E.S.C.O. on H.I.V./A.I.D.S. in the U.K.", is to have a separate RfC about a major change to MOS:ABBR. And such an RfC would fly about as far as a lead dirigible.
— SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 23:53, 6 July 2018 (UTC)
Chicago style is USA (without periods), but we also accept both US and U.S. Other authoritative style manuals and dictionaries vary in their recommendations.
— The Chicago Manual of Style Online. The Chicago Manual of Style 17th edition, 2017.
Here's what the book actually says:
10.4 Periods with abbreviations.
...
3. Use no periods with abbreviations that include two or more capital letters, even if the abbreviation also includes lowercase latters: VP, CEO, MA, MD, PhD, U, US, NY, IL.
4. In publications using traditional state abbreviations, use periods to abbreviate United States and its states and territories: U.S., N.Y., Ill. Note, however, that Chicago recommends using the two-letter postal codes (and therefore US) wherever abbreviations are used....
...
10.27 Abbreviations for US states and territories. In running text, the names of states, territories, and possessions of the United States should always be spelled out when standing alone and preferably (except for DC) when following the name of a city.... In bibliographies, tabular matter, lists, and mailing addresses, they are usually abbreviated. In all such contexts, Chicago prefers the two-letter postal codes to the convention abbreviations. Note that if traditional bbreviations must be used, some terms may not be subject to abbreviation. [... A table is follows illustrating the difference, with examples like NE versus Neb. or Nebr., and showing not to abbreviate short ones like Ohio in the latter style, only in the postal code style, OH.]...
10.28 Abbreviations for Canadian provinces and territories. ... may be abbreviated in bibliographies and the like—using the two-letter postal abbreviations, which have the advantage of applying to both the English and French forms. AB [=] Alberta; ... PE [=] Prince Edward Island ....
...
10.31 Abbreviating country names. ... Certain initialisms, on the other hand [i.e., in lieu of spelled-out names], may be appropriate in regular text, especially after the full form has been established.... UAE (United Arab Emirates), US, UK, GDR ....
...
10.32 "US" versus "United States." ... Note that, as a matter of editorial tradition, this manual has long advised spelling out United States as a noun, reserving US for the adjective form only (where it is preferred) and for tabular matter and the like. In a departure [i.e., from the 16th ed.], Chicago now permits the use of US as a noun, subject to editorial discretion and provided the meaning is clear from context. US dollars; US involvement in China; China's involvement in the United States or China's involvement in the US.
...
10.33 Mailing addresses—postal versus standard abbreviations. Standard abbreviations preferred by the US Postal Service (first column) are in all caps and do not use periods; these forms are most appropriate for mailing addresses. In tabular matter and the like, Chago prefers the form of abbreviations presented in the second column. ... In running text, spell out rather than abbreviate. [... Table provides examples, e.g. AVE versus Ave., BLDG vs. Bldg.; none of these pertain to placename abbreviations like US or PEI.]— The Chicago Manual of Style, 17th ed. (2017), University of Chicago Press, ISBN: 9780226287058
PS: The dominance of "US" isn't "unsubstantiated"; see #RS citations above. If you want to prove a counter-claim, Pyxis Solitary, you have a tremendous amount of sourcing to do, with works somehow more authoritative than those already cited; I don't see how that could even be possible.
— SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 00:17, 9 July 2018 (UTC)
Off-topic. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 05:35, 16 July 2018 (UTC) |
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Comment: How about avoiding U.S: and UK altogether? We can easily write United States and United Kingdom without wasting ink. --NaBUru38 (talk) 02:27, 16 July 2018 (UTC)
WP:BMB basically allows us to delete everything contributed by a banned editor. However, we see cases where banned editors (through socking) are contributing to (or creating) articles which are later substantially edited by other editors, as well as banned editors (through socking) bring good material which can subsequently not be reverted. WP:BMB talks there about that being paradoxal in some cases - the banned editor 'uses' that material to show that they do good.
I am aware of an extreme case of this, where the banned editor is actively participating in article-for-creation drives in order to 'collect' such mainspace 'trophies' to show their good (which includes bragging about their good work, and participating in local ánd 'global' drives using the en.wikipedia article creations/expansions to be eligible for the offered prizes). Some of those 'trophies' cannot be removed through deletion or reverting.
Would it be in the spirit of, and allowed by, WP:BMB/WP:BANREVERT to blundly use revision deletion on the content of the revisions contributed by a banned editor (a condition that could then be added to G5) on those cases where information cannot be deleted, up to a level that in the end there is no visibility of content that the banned editor contributed? --Dirk Beetstra T C 07:02, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
It has always been accepted that for an article submitted by a banned editor, any editor in good standing may adopt it. When I do this , I do not do this lightly. I only do it when I think the subject is so notable that the 1r would be harmed if we did not have the article, and usually only in a field where I normally work. For subjects of just ordinary importance , or ones where I do not work regularly enough to judge or to be confident in rewriting, I generally delete them instead of fixing them. In fact, I've deleted many thousands of such articles. I have rescued only a few hundred. I agree completely with the general policy of removing the work of banned editors, unless there is some reason not to.. The decision of an established editor to adopt on a selective basis is such a reason. (I would think it very improper for an editor to indiscriminately try to rescue all the work of a banned editor without considering which were appropriate, and I do not think that any current established editor here is doing that, though some have come near this is the past) . For these few cases where the article is adopted, I do not think it harms the general effect of denying recognition. RevDel should not be overused, and I don't think it necessary here. It should be limited to where the material is actually improper to be retained because it would harm the encyclopedia. )and consequently I do very little rev del except for copyvio) DGG ( talk ) 08:48, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
OK, as it is apparently not clear (or just blatanly misinterpreted) that I here plainly suggest what you are almost all blaming me not to suggest, case study number 1:
That is the situation that stands at the moment that we block the banned editor. Lets, for the sake of argument, assume that the content is not violating core policies like copyright violations or so, and that someone may want to keep it. Regardless of the content, I MAY chose to delete the whole article at the moment, or I may leave the article (no must!). I have to make a judgement, do I leave the article or not. But I have another possible action I could take with the technical possibilities at hand:
Now the content stands (woohoo, I did not delete the article that you don't want me to delete!). It is all there, untouched. But the content cannot be attributed to the banned editor. It can be edited at will, it is NOT deleted. Heck, you can start a XFD if it is not notable, or extract a DYK from it.
Case study number 2:
That is the situation that stands at the moment we block the banned editor. Could very well be a notable subject, but deletion will very likely upset editor Y (who would ask for immediate undeletion). But we can revdel the content and the username of edit 1. The article still stands, you can still extract a DYK from it. But the DYK cannot be attributed (nor needs to be attributed) to the banned editor.
Case study number 3:
I could rollback the edit, or I can do:
Again, I have KEPT the content. Maybe edit 247 was a revert of vandalism in edit 232, I did not revert to a vandalised state. But it cannot be attributed to the banned editor.
And it is still a choice .. in all three cases I still have the choice to do nothing, to ignore the edits. But some banned editors should not be encouraged to make even the good edits. They are banned, and that is not an action that the community takes lightly.
My whole proposal is to KEEP all the content that we all so desperate want to keep (and only to delete material that violates core policy, or after XFDs), my proposal (well, actually, it was not even a proposal or an attempt to create policy, it was just a question) is to ONLY remove the attribution of the edits of the banned editor in cases where the attribution of the content is the sole/primary reason why the socking editor is continue to sock (and it is still 'may', 'choice', a, how did I word it above, 'allowed', it is not 'must', it is not 'forced', words that I have never used here or anywhere in the last 24 hours regarding our banning policy). I am NOT arguing for a damnatio memoriae for all sockpuppets, I am NOT arguing that I HAVE to delete/revdel everything that any banned editor contributes, I am not even arguing that all edits by a banned editor should be reverted (I am even arguing to keep that). I am only asking whether BMB/BANREVERT allows to apply revdel, or whether this should be an option. (my apologies for my sarcasm) --Dirk Beetstra T C 20:36, 10 August 2018 (UTC)
@Beetstra: Is one of your primary concerns that this banned user will collect a trophy via a sock? It seems like it should be common sense to vacate any trophies retroactively if it was won while in violation of a ban. Would that decrease the motivation to delete "useful" edits?—Bagumba (talk) 07:00, 11 August 2018 (UTC)
Hi. I am proposing a naming conventions for Taiwan stations for better consistency. Feedback welcomed at User talk:Szqecs/Naming conventions (Taiwan stations). Thanks. Szqecs (talk) 08:17, 14 August 2018 (UTC)
Should Wiki: Cross-namespace redirects (or a variation of it) be formalized into a policy or guideline? --TheSandDoctor Talk 17:24, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
Please take a look at WP:General sanctions. That page has never been classified as a policy, essay or just what it is. Please offer your thoughts in that page's talk thread found here. NewsAndEventsGuy (talk) 15:42, 16 August 2018 (UTC)
I searched for past discussions without success, so posting here.
Hoping to find where there's been consensus on when it's appropriate or inappropriate to add the {{Press}} template to an article talk page, and the sorts of articles that should be included.
{{Press}} adds a box in the top/banner section of the talk page with a list of sources under the heading "This page has been mentioned by [a/multiple] media [organization/organizations]".
Is this only for reliable sources? If not, is this for any mention of the article anywhere? Should all instances of being mentioned by included? If not, how should we select?
In many or even most cases, none of this would be controversial and we can just say "whatever the local consensus is." But I think it would be useful to have some kind of guidance, especially for controversial topics that attract comment from partisan sources displeased that the Wikipedia article does not fit into a preferred narrative.
We see this sort of complaint pretty consistently with our articles on pseudoscience topics, for example. We've also seen it with US politics-related articles where one side or the other is upset at the coverage of a topic or the conduct of users editing a topic.
The press box is one of the first things someone will see when coming to the talk page. If you have some concern, and you see it sensationalized in an unreliable partisan source, that will intensify the ensuing discussion. If you didn't have a concern, and see an ill-informed complaint in the headline of a source in the press box, that will have an effect on the ensuing discussion. Why is it desirable to involve these mentions in discussions of how to improve our article? None of this is to say that external sources are never useful. It is indeed useful to understand how uninvolved/outside parties view Wiki English. But editors can link to them on their own in the context of those discussions without accumulating them to display as a smorgasbord of uncontextualized knee-jerk reactions, opinion pieces, unreliable sources, etc. in addition to the thoughtful critiques.
Ultimately, I think that we need some sort of even loose standards for these boxes. Either their use at all (i.e. maybe omit from controversial subjects, perhaps defined by those subject to discretionary sanctions), their content (using reliable sources only, for example), or their styling (adding a link to media coverage on a separate page, collapsing by default, etc.). — Rhododendrites talk \\ 16:30, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
Wiki editor GreenMeansGo was a total dickhead on this one article.and then post it in a press template because it's "some coverage" of the article.
Wiki editor GreenMeansGo was a total dickhead on this one article., well, they're a reliable source of the type we regularly use in articles to support BLP content, and the issue of POV by weight doesn't really apply to the talk page the same way as it applies to the article...and maybe it would be helpful for that guy to consider that his behavior was worth mentioning by the Guardian. Reliable sources are what determines if article content is a BLP violation, but BLP doesn't apply to the content of sources themselves. GMGtalk 17:07, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
Giant Wikipedia edit war over NYT reporter., well then that's a claim about an event that happened on Wikipedia, which has a much lower burden of proof than whether someone is racist, and that might be something that Bb is acceptable for. GMGtalk 17:32, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
Wikipedia's biographies of living persons policy applies to all pages, including talk pages and the use of external links, and so the use of this template must also comply with this higher standard. Do not use this template to highlight poor quality sources, of the type that normally would not be sufficient to support article content. This is especially important when dealing with contentious material, although any poorly sourced material on living persons, even that which is neutral or positive, can and should be removed. When in doubt, discuss the appropriateness of the template and sources on the article's talk page, or consider seeking input at the Biographies of Living Persons Noticeboard or the Reliable Sources Noticeboard.
Do not use this template to highlight poor quality sources that would not normally be sufficient to support article content. This is especially important on the talk pages of contentious subjects. Wikipedia's biographies of living persons policy applies to all pages, including talk pages and use of external links, and poor sources should be removed from talk pages of articles about living persons even if neutral or positive. When in doubt, discuss the appropriateness of the template and sources on the article's talk page, or consider seeking input at the Biographies of Living Persons Noticeboard or the Reliable Sources Noticeboard.
Do not use this template to highlight poor quality sources that would not normally be sufficient to support article content. This is especially important on the talk pages of contentious subjects. Wikipedia's biographies of living persons policy applies to all pages, including talk pages, and to the use of external links. Poor sources should be removed from talk pages of articles about living persons even if neutral or positive. When in doubt, discuss the appropriateness of the template and sources on the article's talk page, or consider seeking input at the Biographies of Living Persons Noticeboard or the Reliable Sources Noticeboard.
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Should a policy or guideline be developed/formalized relating to the cross-namespace wiki linking of drafts within articles (ie article A contains a wikilink to Draft B, which itself does not have a mainspace article)? To clarify: I dont mean redirects, I am talking of links to drafts within articles. --TheSandDoctor Talk 18:34, 15 August 2018 (UTC)
I have noticed an issue recently on AfD's on football teams. People are citing WP:FOOTYN as if it is a subject specific notability guideline (SNG). It looks like a link to an official SNG (the correct link is actually WP:NFOOTY), but FOOTYN is an essay maintained by Wikiproject Football. FOOTYN as a keyword seems to me to clearly be a lookalike POV-fork of WP:NFOOTY, and also easy to mistake for that one. Moreover, its contents are contrary to the official SNG on the topic, which clearly states that teams must pass the General Notability Guideline (See: Wiki: Notability_(sports)#Teams). Teams used to be covered by WP:NCORP, before it was rewritten earlier this year, when teams were excluded from NCORP. In the old NCORP guideline teams were given no special treatment or automatic notability criterion either. After NCORP was rewritten, Wiki: Notability_(sports)#Teams was changed to redirect to WP:GNG instead, which essentially changed nothing about notability for teams (still given no special treatment and still subject only to the GNG).
As far as I can see, members of Wikiproject Football seem to be making up rules that are contrary to our guidelines as written, and citing them as if they were an official Subject Specific Notability Guideline. We need to do one of two things:
Which should it be? I'd like to hear some other views on this situation. — Insertcleverphrasehere (or here) 16:36, 9 August 2018 (UTC)
Relisted AfD Wiki: Articles for deletion/Cray Valley Paper Mills F.C. (mentioned above) has been relisted, and can use more participants to reach a consensus on football notability criteria.—Bagumba (talk) 00:14, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
What's the policy on social media and Wikipedia? I think it's not a bad idea to have a Twitter hashtag to highlight articles that need work, for example. The most recent tweets would not necessarily be of most importance, just more recent discoveries or recently created articles. From here, WikiEditors can have a centralized place from which to find new articles to work on. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Polariz36 (talk • contribs) 15:50, 21 August 2018 (UTC)
Should userboxes related to politics be explicitly forbidden and deleted? See WP:UBCR and Wiki: Userboxes/Politics. --Pudeo (talk) 16:07, 19 August 2018 (UTC)
I was looking for an old discussion and found Wiki: Village pump (proposals)/Archive 73, which is rendered increasingly illegible as you go down the page by a series of broken signatures. Of course the boilerplate at the top includes "Please do not edit the contents of this page." I made a cursory search but didn't find a real rule about that. Obviously fixing the broken formatting would be an improvement, so maybe just WP:IAR. What do you think? Ntsimp (talk) 16:21, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
I support this! ~~~~
that causes the whole page to be in strikeout, fix that bad closing tag, don't "fix" it by removing the opening tag. — xaosflux Talk 16:27, 24 August 2018 (UTC)This post regards the above discussions linked. The question is: Can major layout changes be implemented to a Featured List, based on the consensus of two supporting editors, with the changes themselves based only on a guideline?
MOS:TVPLOT, the guideline in question, states that for television series' season articles, an article should not have both an episode table and a prose summary
. This is not a policy, and suggests "should not" rather than "cannot". Radiphus proposed a merger proposal of the prose content in each season article to List of Game of Thrones episodes, the Featured List in question, on the Episode List's talk page. He received the support of two editors, and later deemed this enough to close the merger discussion himself with the result of a consensus.
Should such a discussion have been advertised elsewhere, such as WP:VPPOL, WT:TV and/or WT:MOSTV? As can be seen, after the discussion was started, no advertising was made beside the use of merger templates on the article. Is the consensus from two supporting editors enough to make such a change to a Featured List? -- AlexTW 08:21, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
proposed policies and guidelines and changes to existing policies and guidelines. It's not the place
to resolve disputes over how a policy should be implemented. You may proceed as you see fit. - Radiphus 09:45, 26 August 2018 (UTC)
This edit points out this page. But on that page there is nothing that says how to proceed. How is this done? Michael Hardy (talk) 08:06, 24 August 2018 (UTC)
I'm not sure if this is the best place to discuss this. I have raised some concerns at Talk:Jehovah#Wikisource. It seems that any user could go edit the Wikisource archive. This may open the possibility to circular issues (summarizing user-altered content) or simply point at an inaccurate archive if it was altered. An interesting thing that I noticed however is that archives link appear to have been preserved at another article where another editor also introduces a Wikisource template: [21] vs [22]. However, while [23] appears to work fine, [24] doesn't. If there's an ongoing effort to archive using Wikisource, likely that there's a proper venue to make sure that these concerns are addressed? Thanks, —PaleoNeonate – 13:59, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
After debates at Talk:Illinois gubernatorial election, 2018 and Talk:Ohio gubernatorial election, 2018 regarding what candidates should be included in the infobox, there is now going to be a similar discussion at Talk:United States Senate election in Virginia, 2018.
The rough consensus seems to be to include candidates that get 5% or more in multiple polls. However, supporters of candidates who get less than that are generally unhappy with that decision, and I know of no site-wide consensus on this topic. I wish to find one. power~enwiki (π, ν) 00:46, 16 August 2018 (UTC)
In my opinion, all candidates confirmed for ballot access in any political race should be included on the article for that race, equally, regardless of polling, perception, or assumptions. Significant write-ins should also be included. Anything less would be bias, reduce integrity of Wikipedia, and weaken Wikipedia's reputation. There is a process to get certified to appear on a ballot, and once that has been completed, why take steps to exclude candidates here? Schultzjm1 (talk) 20:36, 27 August 2018 (UTC)
We seem to be no closer to a consensus here. My sense is that there's a very weak preference towards including all candidates over the other feasible option of including all candidates which have received 5% in a poll (or are considered "major" candidates in a race without polling. Including "candidates with Wikipedia articles" is an unworkable criteria for a variety of reasons, primarily because coverage of candidates purely in the context of a current political campaign is generally not considered sufficient for meeting WP:GNG. New York gubernatorial election, 2018 is another page with a similar dispute. power~enwiki (π, ν) 03:58, 29 August 2018 (UTC)
(I'm not a regular at the policy village pump or any other policy page, so I don't know, but it seems to me that a policy proposal should be mentioned on this page, even if it's currently visible via the Centralized discussion list.) --Pipetricker (talk) 12:16, 30 August 2018 (UTC)
@Primefac and Bsherr: I think using migration is much better then the current WP:SPLIT and (then) WP:MERGE, using split then merge creates confusion as you're not really doing a proper split or merge, as the page you're moving content to already exist and the page you're moving content from doesn't get deleted. As such the guidelines don't fully describe this process making it confusing for users who are new to this kind of stuff. Also, it's just more convenient, and simpler to look at one guideline that explain the whole process vs 2 that don't explain the process properly. Currently the templates used for this process have totally random names some relating to splitting some relating to merging and some don't even properly explain the procedure and they are made for different processes on Wiki English. Comment: If you don't like the name migrate and maybe content move would be better? – BrandonXLF (t@lk) 12:38, 2 September 2018 (UTC)
I had cause to write a bit about Wikipedia dispute resolution processes this afternoon and came to Wiki: Requests for mediation. On autopilot, I started to summarize its role/policy, and wrote that it doesn't see much use these days. Curious, I went to see just how active it is. I haven't seen any request for mediation linked in an awful long time, but maybe I'm just not looking in the right places.
It looks like there have been two requests for mediation accepted in the past two years, and it's unclear to me how successful they were: Wiki: Requests for mediation/FXCM and Wiki: Requests for mediation/Expulsion of Cham Albanians.
Practically speaking, does RFM still play an active role in the dispute resolution process? My sense is no, in which case it may be time to talk about marking it as historical and updating our policy pages. — Rhododendrites talk \\ 19:26, 17 August 2018 (UTC)
To be clear, this is not a proposal but a discussion that may or may not lead to a proposal. I wouldn't want to propose such a thing with my limited experience with the process, and a proposal would really take a formal RfC likely posted to centralized discussion. — Rhododendrites talk \\ 20:02, 17 August 2018 (UTC)
Hi there, I was just writing something about Wikipedia's DR processes and realized I wasn't really clear about a couple things. Also want to ping Robert McClenon, since he is also active in these matters. Could you give me your take on the practical difference between RFM and DRN? DRN has designated volunteers. RFM has a Committee. But beyond that? Has the distinction changed over time? It seems like RFM has significantly waned in activity (2 cases accepted in the last 2 years). My sense is that DRN has also been used less as RfCs have become the more or less default formal consensus building process. What about WP:MEDCAB? Obviously inactive now, but how did it fit in? I'm not certain of the chronology and have only heard about it in passing mentions myself. Thanks. Also, I opened a thread at WP:VPP about RFM you may be interested to participate in. These questions here are more for my personal edification. :) — Rhododendrites talk \\ 20:07, 17 August 2018 (UTC)
|
I'm more active on Commons these days, but I am usually available to take on a mediation case. TransporterMan usually handles the WP:RFM process, but if he disappears I or another could take the chair role. I do think the concern about our lack of cases is valid. Most disputes are resolved through informal talk page or noticeboard discussion, or one party gives up at some point. Cases involving clear, one-sided conduct problems are settled by community or admin sanctions. The rest are complex, long-term issues, and few people can remain immaculate after months in Wikipedia's trenches. Those go to arbitration. This doesn't leave much for the mediation committee.
Still, I have no doubt there are several cases each year which could benefit from mediation. They parties give up (on the issue, or on Wikipedia), or the case escalates to arbitration. Could we do better in identifying these cases and inviting them to WP:RFM? How? —Guanaco 02:52, 20 August 2018 (UTC)
There are two basic problems with MEDCOM which partially offset each other. I would like to try to address them separately. The first problem is that too few cases that are appropriate for formal mediation are being filed with MEDCOM. The second problem, which is almost hidden by the first, is that there are not enough mediators. I will comment that both of these problems are more general problems in Wikipedia that are not limited to formal mediation.
Too few proper cases are being filed with MEDCOM. In 2018, 23 cases were filed, and 23 cases were declined by the MEDCOM. (A total of 276 cases were declined by the MEDCOM since 2013.) Most of them were declined because of one or more of inadequate discussion on the article talk page, failure to use lower-level dispute resolution mechanisms, failure of one or more parties to agree to mediation, or improper filing (not listing the other parties). There aren’t very many disputes, even in a period of a few years, for which formal mediation is appropriate. I will also comment that most of the cases that are filed with the dispute resolution noticeboard are declined, either for inadequate discussion on the article talk page, lack of agreement to informal mediation, or improper filing. There are a relatively large number of disputes that are procedurally declined. Either there are not very many disputes for which formal or informal mediation is appropriate, or there are a number of such disputes that are not being sent to dispute resolution. My own guess is that one primary reason is that there are relatively few “pure content” disputes, because most content disputes also involve conduct issues by one or more parties. Often, such disputes are resolved after the warrior is sanctioned.
I will again suggest that perhaps DRN should serve as a gateway to formal mediation.
There are not enough formal mediators. There are also not enough volunteers at DRN who are actually willing to mediate cases, as opposed to providing help in other ways. We, the community, need to publicize the need for mediators, especially with some sort of outside training in dispute resolution.
I will comment that, about two or three years ago, Jimmy Wales suggested that the WMF hire some professional mediators to provide services to the various Wikipedia communities for dispute resolution. I don’t know whether that offer was meant seriously, or was just meant to divert attention from either the WMF’s excess money or the WMF’s inability and lack of interest in what actually goes on in the English Wiki English. I have very mixed feelings, because I am not sure whether those mediators, being paid professionals, would give proper respect to the volunteers who are the English Wikipedia, or whether they would try to impose their own ideas.
We need both more mediators with experience in dispute resolution and volunteers to assist in informal dispute resolution. Perhaps we also need to provide more awareness of existing resources for dispute resolution, but perhaps we only have a few “pure content” disputes that are amenable to mediation.
Comments? Robert McClenon (talk) 00:18, 22 August 2018 (UTC)
There is currently an RfC at Module talk:Infobox military conflict/Archive 4#Request for comment if anyone wants to comment. EtherealGate (talk) 20:08, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
Multi-level user warning templates are used to add boilerplate text on user talk pages to warn of vandalism or other issues; they typically come in four or more increasingly sternly-worded, versions (e.g., {{uw-vandalism1}}, 2, 3, 4, im). Your feedback on whether it is appropriate to skip levels is welcome at WT:UW#Skipping warning levels. Thank you, Mathglot (talk) 22:26, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
There is currently an RfC on whether or not blocked users can edit their talk page for anything other than block appeals. Please discuss this at Wiki talk:Blocking policy#RfC: Blocked editors and their talk pages. Thanks. Nihlus 16:05, 4 September 2018 (UTC)
Hi, guys! I noticed that the Portuguese Wiki has a notice asking for contributors to send and upload any items from the National Museum of Brazil, which was destroyed in the 2018 fire, to the Wiki Commons. The original notice in Portuguese is here, and I wrote an English version of the message.
I think it would be a good idea to display this notice on ENwiki too, linking to the English translation. Some people visiting the museum were foreigners, and they might also have some key images. WhisperToMe (talk) 12:06, 5 September 2018 (UTC)
Hello. First of all I want to say that I am a Greek Cypriots. But I believe that I have Neutral point of view. Sorry about using words like "occupied", "free" etc. It's easier to explain that way.
Some areas in the island of Cyprus are belong to Republic of Cyprus De jure and also are belong to Northern Cyprus De facto.
There is no problem having articles for the villages and municipalities of Northern Cyprus. We can do the same as any other village or municipality in the planet. They claim that they are a country (even though not recognized), they have their own administrative territorial entity.
For districts we already have separated articles. (Please see Districts of Cyprus and Districts of Northern Cyprus.
There are six districts in Republic of Cyprus. Of them:
The parts of that districts that is in north Cyprus, are consisting Northern Cyprus. Northern Cyprus is divided to 5 districts.
As you can see, these districts do not identify with the "occupied" districts of Cyprus, perhaps with the sole exception of the province of Kyrenia (Girne), without being absolutely sure ... We have a separate articles for each district of Republic of Cyprus and for every district of Northern Cyprus.
At this point, I would like to mention that Republic of Cyprus, although it does not control these areas, continues to have administrations for them. For example, District Administration of Kyrenia. For districts, I have identified only one problem: population. In Girne District we can write the population as recorded by Northern Cyprus. In Kyrenia District we cannot write the population according to Republic of Cyprus because the census cannot apply to "occupied" areas. And we cannot write the population recorded by Northern Cyprus because the two districts are not the same. Especially in other districts there is certainly no match. For example, in Famagusta District, Republic of Cyprus recorded only the "free" areas. For 2011 census that population was 46629. The population of that district (the way Republic of Cyprus defined it) include people that lives it the area of the district under control of Northern Cyprus. But they don’t count them. And we cannot easily counted them because the "relative" Gazimağusa District has not the same area as Famagusta District.
The main problem is about municipalities and communities (villages). Republic of Cyprus elects mayors, municipal councils, community councils for all "occupied" municipalities, has Geographical codes of the Republic of Cyprus for all of these areas, etc. With always the footnote that concern areas belonging to Republic of Cyprus but not are controlled by Republic of Cyprus because of the presence of the Turkish army. Of course, Northern Cyprus also elects mayors, has their own codes etc.
Problems:
And more other problems like:
I am not sure about any solution. The only I have though:
For communities, we can have two articles for each community. Like:
It that useful? Again, however, it is not certain that each village is terribly identified as Republic of Cyprus and Northern Cyprus mean it, even though they have the same name (translated between to Greek and Turkish).
And the problem is even more complicated for semi-"occupied" municipalities with population in both Republic of Cyprus and Northern Cyprus. An example is Nicosia Municipality (according to Republic of Cyprus). Part of it is in Northern Cyprus. Of course, we have article about North Nicosia.
I have asked the same to wikidata. d:Wikidata:Project chat/Archive/2018/08#Areas of Cyprus Republic (de jure)/Areas of Northern Cyprus (de facto). The solution they propose was to have 2 item for each village (Is easiest in Wikidata :). Like Gangwon Province (historical), Kangwon Province (North Korea), Gangwon Province, South Korea, Hwanghae Province (Republic of Korea), North Hwanghae Province, South Hwanghae Province, Hwanghae Province, Taiwan Province, Taiwan, Fujian Province, Republic of China, Fujian, Lianjiang County, Lianjiang County. I already have applied that. The explanations was that there are two distinct and separate structures in place. A Greek and a Turkish structure with only overlap where the structures indicate physical objects like human settlements are in both and create two artocles for not for the settlements but for all the "administrative and territorial units", they are "per country".
Of course, you may believe that we must not change anything. (Sorry about my Enlgish). Xaris333 (talk) 21:56, 6 September 2018 (UTC)
I am stumped about something and am hoping someone can help me out. We have an article on a woman named Maria Elvira Salazar that was apparently created on 25 April 2017 with this edit but a user named Lcast043. What I don't get is how this editor was able to create the article: the creation of this article was and remains his/ her only WP edit to date, but it doesn't look like the article went through AfC or any other review process. The editor certainly didn't have 10 edits and 4 days of editing history— shouldn't that have made it impossible for him/ her to create a new article like this? I am missing something, but I don't understand what. If anyone has any ideas, please let me know. Will check back here regularly for responses. Thanks! A loose noose (talk) 00:42, 9 September 2018 (UTC)
This RfC is a followup to a June 2017 RfC clarifying the relation between SNGs and the GNG. Consensus was established that SNGs do not supersede GNG, but there was no consensus as to what to do about the articles not apparently meeting GNG. A pre-RfC discussion has show two major issues: What the final result should be, and what to do in the interim to avoid flooding AfD and related venues, which will be discussed as a follow up. The main options are keep, tag, merge, transwiki or delete.— Alpha3031 (t • c) 03:20, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
is used to help evaluate whether or not a sports person or sports league/organization (amateur or professional) is likely to meet the general notability guideline"Implicitly, GNG should usually be met by meeting the SNG. Are you stating that articles on modern sports subjects should not be covered by NSPORTS? Or are you saying that some existing NSPORTS criteria need to be tightened to ensure that GNG is likely to be met?—Bagumba (talk) 10:56, 3 September 2018 (UTC)
It is incredibly difficult and uncommon for an athlete to reach these levels. You could train every day and do everything right, and still not ever play in a fully professional football game.This is true of most careers. Sports are not special in this regard.
athletes virtually universally receive a great deal of pressThen that evidence should be presented at the AFD in question, not a handwave to the SNG. --Izno (talk) 18:59, 7 September 2018 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
Currently we have just 780 articles tagged with template:Undisclosed paid (UDP), a particular aspect of more general template:COI. I think mere tagging for suspected UDP editing is toothless - the potential paid editor gets the job done anyway and the article becomes indexed by search engines, hanging around indefinitely until someone cleans it. Moving all UDP-tagged articles to the non-indexed draft space and keeping them there untill they're fixed and ready to return to the mainspace could be a good solution. Also in this option, any new UDP-tagged article might be draftified by any registered user. If adopted, the proposal might entail corresponding addendums in relevant pages. Thoughts (support, oppose, comments)? Brandmeistertalk 13:40, 14 July 2018 (UTC)
con=
and conreason=
filled out ie disallow 'I just don't like prod's prod removal'. Personally I would like to see that requirement for all PRODs but I know a loosing battle when I see one :) #2 choice support proposal for moving them to draft but it seems to be the less accountable and reviewable of the two. Regardless, if this is to become a regular thing, a tracking category should be added when either is done to facilitate review. Jbh Talk 11:07, 15 July 2018 (UTC)Just a heads up to page watchers that I've started an RfC on whether to disallow text highlighting in signatures at Wiki talk:Signatures#RfC: Should we disallow text highlighting in signatures?. Comments welcome there. — Rhododendrites talk \\ 18:57, 12 September 2018 (UTC)
The Wikiproject Football notability essay, WP:WikiProject_Football/Notability (commonly linked as WP:FOOTYN), is still being used as an argument of notability/lack of notability in deletion discussions. I attempted to forestall this by adding a link and note at the club section pointing to WP:NTEAM (the actual SNG related to teams) and advising not to use the essay as an argument for inherent notability in deletion discussions. I have twice been reverted by Number 57([27][28]) for adding a supplemental hatnote to the club notability section at WP:WikiProject_Football/Notability.
I have opened a section at Wiki talk:WikiProject Football/Notability#Hatnote for club section linking to the actual SNG section on team notability to discuss this addition, but wanted to post here to draw wider community input. Please comment at the talk page of the relevant page rather than here. Cheers, — Insertcleverphrasehere (or here) 23:20, 13 September 2018 (UTC)
There is a discussion at Wiki talk:Editing restrictions regarding the logging of restrictions imposed as an unblocking condition, as well as formal logging of editor warnings. Administrators and editors are invited to participate in the discusson. Thanks. Ivanvector (Talk/Edits) 16:40, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
The following discussion is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
This is a follow up to User_talk:CitationCleanerBot#Via. According to Nikkimaria (talk · contribs) and Vanamonde93 (talk · contribs), they put citations like
by the reasoning "It wasn't used to advertise the service; it was used to acknowledge the access provided by Project Muse to certain Wikipedia users." This is apparently to comply with partnership requirements where they have gained personal access to pay-for-access databases (in this case Project MUSE) through The Wikipedia Library, where in return they need to mention in our articles that they had made use of Project MUSE.
Should the practice be allowed to continue? Or under which condition should |via=
be used? Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 15:32, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
Disallow: This is something that is a textbook WP:SPAM/WP:PROMO situation. Citations exist to verify our material, not advertise pay-for-access academic services. While we have links that often point to paywalled ressources, such as DOIs in our article, those are vendor-neutral identifiers are there to help identify the citation. WP:SAYWHERE is clear about this:
The advice to "say where you read it" does not mean that you have to give credit to any search engines, websites, libraries, library catalogs, archives, subscription services, bibliographies, or other sources that led you to Smith's book. If you have read a book or article yourself, that's all you have to cite. You do not have to specify how you obtained and read it. [emphasis mine]
The following
fully complies with WP:SAYWHERE, and links to Project MUSE resources in a way that does not unduly promote a commercial service. Further, using the URL to further link to the paywalled Project MUSE is fully redundant with the DOI, and discourages editors from finding non-paywalled versions of the paper.
Things like
are ridiculous.
This is a horrendous practice, and one that needs to end now. If Project MUSE wants attribution in some way, that can be done in edit summaries, or via the talk page. Not in the main bodies of our articles. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 15:32, 28 June 2018 (UTC)
|via=
parameter is not a requirement of citing resources obtained through The Wikipedia Library, and the citations found on the old signup pages (e.g. Wiki: Project MUSE) are only a suggestion for a fully formatted citation. I can absolutely see how the text there makes it seem like more of a requirement, however, and I’ll rewrite that section to make it clearer, in addition to the note that is already present.|via=
parameter of our citation templates". Maybe this is the source of confusion? Or possibly pages like Wikipedia:Credo/Citations and other similar pages? If this isn't a requirement, those pages should be updated to de-promotionalize those services. Nikkimaria (talk · contribs) and Vanamonde93 (talk · contribs), what led you to believe that using |via=
to 'credit' Project MUSE was required/encouraged? Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 19:15, 28 June 2018 (UTC) "provide original citation information in addition to linking to Project MUSE resources"and
"Cite resources in line with the citation examples provided below or with the examples provided by Project MUSE"(the example in question uses the
|via=
parameter. The version of the instructions that existed when I received access was even more definitive about this. Vanamonde (talk) 03:44, 29 June 2018 (UTC)|via=
etc. in a specific way for sources from that particular archive or service when appropriate. So when you access a journal article through a third party service—rather than on paper in your local library or directly from the publisher—you specify that you're citing the copy provided there rather than an original. The TWL example citations have been formed based on SAYWHEREYOUGOTIT and are intended to be used in accordance with SAYWHEREYOUGOTIT, including their mostly being optional and when it is not appropriate to include such |via=
parameters.By all means lets discuss the finer points of how we should apply SAYWHEREYOUGOTIT to the TWL resources, but please don't let your knee-jerk reaction based on limited (and obviously skewed) information turn that discussion into a pointless drama fest that will achieve nothing but tarnish the coordinators and other volunteers working very hard to improve the encyclopedia. Please. --Xover (talk) 17:01, 28 June 2018 (UTC)|via=
parameter. I might even have some opinions on some of these issues (then again, probably not enough to argue about them). You want to do any of those things, have at it. Heck, if for some reason you need my help with any of those, I'd be happy to step up.But we can't have any of those discussions, at least not productively, in an RFC framed in an inflamatory way (That is, "in a way that is likely to have the effect of inflaming", not "in a way intended to inflame") and based on incorrect information. So, again, please—please!—reconsider: either by reframing the current RFC, or by withdrawing and trying again when you're less outraged by what is incorrect information! --Xover (talk) 19:22, 28 June 2018 (UTC)|via=Google Books
for books that Google is providing snippet views of and other "digitally digested" content, because we are not looking at the literal book itself and cannot, e.g., be 100% that the book's original text, pagination, etc. were preserved correctly by Google's OCR and other munging. We don't need to use it for old-book scans that Google hosts, because they are exact photographic facsimilies (often including the library cards :-). It's useful to say that you got a journal article via a particular journals database, because you are not literally reading the actual journal, but a PDF prepared from submitted content not a scan, or an HTML text-and-images relayout, or something like that (sometimes it's even a pre-print copy which may be pre-peer-review, too – same goes for arXiv), not a photographic facsimile. — SMcCandlish ☏ ¢ 😼 19:40, 28 June 2018 (UTC)|via=
. I'm only talking about cases where there's no URL given, when things are redundant with links that are already provided by identifiers, or that the reproduction hosted by Database X is a faithful reproduction. Headbomb {t · c · p · b} 19:49, 28 June 2018 (UTC)|via=
notices, except when they add something for the reader (e.g. Google Books preview) AND when that wouldn't be already linked through DOI/PMID etc. We're not an affiliate site. There's already an annoying amount of paywalled links (e.g. Highbeam) to newspaper articles that are readily available for free from the newspaper website or archive.org. BTW I was less than impressed the Project MUSE's crappy primary-sourced, unreadable Wikipedia page. What do they offer that we should bend the rules for? I'd rather do this for arXiv, the awareness of which the readers at large could actually benefit from. Daß Wölf 00:35, 16 July 2018 (UTC)|via=
and am not at all bothered by its inclusion even where it is unnecessary.|via=
parameter: {{cite thesis |last=Mirkovic |first=Alexander |year=2002 |title=Prelude to Constantine: The Invented Tradition of King Abgar of Edessa |id=Order No. 3047451 |publisher=Vanderbilt University |url=https://www.academia.edu/2028649/Prelude_to_Constantine_Dissertation |via=Academia.edu |access-date=31 August 2017}} Also available via [http://search.proquest.com/docview/276422499 ProQuest].
|via=
parameter be omitted in most cases. Daask (talk) 19:44, 14 August 2018 (UTC)Hello. There's an important RfC regarding which companies are to be listed in the infobox for anime films. It can be found at Wiki talk:WikiProject Anime and manga#Request for Comment: Is it relevant to list all production companies or just main animation studios in the infobox of film articles?. Lord Sjones23 (talk - contributions) 19:12, 22 September 2018 (UTC)
Some articles contain two images sharing one caption to show that they are related. Often they are captioned with "Left: (Description) Right: (Description)". The problem with this is that on mobile wikipedia, under a certain screen size, the images become stacked which could cause readers on phones to misunderstand them. Because of this a new policy may need to be made to specify how to caption these double images in some way other than left and right but it is unclear how it should be done. Some possibilities are:
🌸 WeegaweeK ^ 🌸 17:46, 23 September 2018 (UTC)
At Talk:Dan_Sullivan_(American_senator)#Requested_move_8_September_2018 it is pointed out that Senator and Senators are often capitalized when they should not be per MOS:JOBTITLES; e.g. should be List of U.S. senators from X, but U.S. Senate and Senator Smith. Do we have consensus to fix this widespread error with the help of scripts, bots, or other tools? -- Dicklyon (talk) 02:05, 14 September 2018 (UTC)
More specifically, are there any objections to this bot request I just submitted: Wiki: Bot_requests#Bot to fix capitalization of "Senator" in specific contexts? I realize this won't fix everything; maybe we can find more patterns that are safe to do automatically. Dicklyon (talk) 03:48, 15 September 2018 (UTC)
On a related note, I have filed a CFD discussion regarding Category:Alabama State Senators; Wiki: Categories for discussion/Log/2018 September 17 is the log-page. power~enwiki (π, ν) 02:39, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
I support bot treatment, but perhaps it should be by human review. Tony (talk) 03:45, 27 September 2018 (UTC)
This repeated badgering of readers is inappropriate, and should stop.
It is irrelevant to our mission - to provide reliable information. — Preceding unsigned comment added by JohnWheater (talk • contribs) 07:02, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
If you are interested in the nature of notability – why some potential subjects can be developed into separate articles, while some equivalent subjects are better presented as part of a larger article – then you might be interested in watching Wiki: Articles for deletion/Chitty (cricketer). I think there are a couple of thoughtful comments there. WhatamIdoing (talk) 18:18, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
It occurs to me that I may not be clear about proper procedure concerning redirects (or concerning RfD).
My assumption is that a band not mentioned anywhere on Wikipedia should not point to a list of bands simply because it is a band, that we should not have redirects from websites to lists of websites that don't include that website, and that we shouldn't have a pile of redirects to a list of software from specific examples of that software that aren't mentioned in our list (or anywhere on Wikipedia).
If I'm right, could someone highlight exactly where it says that? If I'm not right, what am I missing? — Rhododendrites talk \\ 16:40, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
The redirect might cause confusion.(never mind the example). I think when a redirect term is not mentioned at its target, it's going to be confusing to the reader who follows the redirect. --Izno (talk) 17:42, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
I'm thinking about proposing that we adopt Wiki: Blocking IP addresses as policy. Currently it is only an WP:INFOPAGE, but really it describes what I think should be binding policy. Before I do this, does anyone have any reason I should reconsider proposing this? -Obsidi (talk) 02:57, 5 October 2018 (UTC)
The "rule of thumb" listed in Wiki: Article size for splitting an article has not changed since 2008 (at least). Is it possible to update these values? because I feel that some good articles (therefore long) are unnecessarily split by following this rule, thus reducing Wikipedia's readability. Nowadays, articles are significantly lengthened by the increased use of citations (many articles have hundreds of citations, often with external links). Browsers have made significant progress in ten years and can display such large pages; I think it is time for a change. Values in the scale should be at least doubled imo. Another way to improve this rule would be to exclude citations/references from the calculation. T8612 19:06, 17 September 2018 (UTC)
Hello all, a new access group was implemented by the Growth Team (copyviobot) which can be used by bots to add a special tag to the new pages feed for suspected copyright violations. See prior discussion regarding the group's creation here: Wiki: Bots/Noticeboard#New_bot-like_access_group and an active BRFA that would like to trial this feature here: Wiki: Bots/Requests for approval/EranBot 3. I propose the following updates in support of this:
Bureaucrats
) to Add group
and Remove group
of the copyviobot
group. I've started a proposed new naming conventions for articles on railway stations in Ireland at Wiki: Naming conventions (Irish stations). It's modeled after the other former conventions already established for Canada (WP:CANSTATION, Poland (WP:PLSTATION), the UK (WP:UKSTATION), and the U.S. (WP:USSTATION). It was written to follow the unwritten practice already in place as closely as possible. Comments and suggestions are welcome.--Cúchullain t/c 18:36, 15 October 2018 (UTC)
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