articles For Deletion/Baltic Festivals

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

restarting an article based on the sources is permitted. Spartaz ^Humbug! 06:02, 10 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Baltic festivals

Baltic festivals (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View log · Stats)
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Unreferenced list, quite possibly original research. Unclear what is included and what is not, and why. I guess supposed to list festivals celebrated by Baltic pagans (or neopagans?), but why then include Estonia which belongs to Uralic group? I am also not seeing the reason for the list - What do Latvian festivals have in common with Lithuanian to belong in the same list? In general, the Baltic mythology is a very messy area full of neopagan b/s due to lack of reliable historical sources and this list is not helping any. Renata (talk) 03:04, 14 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Estonia-related deletion discussions. MT Train^Discuss 05:20, 14 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Latvia-related deletion discussions. MT Train^Discuss 05:20, 14 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lithuania-related deletion discussions. MT Train^Discuss 05:20, 14 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The reason why I made this article was simply to translate a list of such festivals within the Lithuanian Wikipedia (Sąrašas:Baltų šventės) into English. They are supposed to be about traditional festivals observed by the Baltic peoples (in Lithuania and Latvia, because both of them practice similar cultures), but due to some user also including a list of Estonia, I added some more for Estonia as well. PulauKakatua19 (talk) please leave a reply. :D 16:13, 14 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Lithuanian list is not any better. Renata (talk) 01:07, 15 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Then somebody needs to do something at the Lithuanian Wikipedia to check if it is factual or not. PulauKakatua19 please leave a reply. :D 12:01, 22 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

I removed Estonia, because it's not even close to including actual historical holidays/festivals or beliefs/traditions (almost forgotten now), hard to find a good source so not even Estonian Wikipedia has a proper article (et:Eesti rahvakalender is something... and et:Maavalla rahvakalender probably gets deleted). This Runic calendar is Estonia-related. Current holidays: Public holidays in Estonia, and we had Estonian neopaganism. --Pelmeen10 (talk) 09:27, 15 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Events-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple (talk) 22:58, 18 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
Note: This discussion has been included in the list of Lists-related deletion discussions. Coolabahapple (talk) 22:58, 18 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Comment, heres a book that discusses some Baltic festivals - Urban Carnival: Festive Culture in the Hanseatic Cities of the Eastern Baltic, 1350-1550, and another - Baltic phrasebook) which goes towards meeting WP:LISTN ie. "One accepted reason why a list topic is considered notable is if it has been discussed as a group or set by independent reliable sources". Coolabahapple (talk) 08:38, 24 February 2018 (UTC)[reply]
  • These are not valid sources. The Baltic phrasebook is essentially a dictionary so can't be used to establish notability of anything. Urban Carnival is available in snipped view on Google Books and I cannot find any evidence it mentions any of the festivals included in the list. Renata (talk) 17:25, 3 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

• Possibly a tentative keep based on the sources found by Coolabahapple, but this is clearly a calendar of events that are supposed to happen now in modern times. It is not framed as historical. The corresponding lt.wikipedia article appears to be quite different and defines the events as "state, national and religious holidays, memorable days." If this is accurate, it should be possible to prove this. But the existing content may not be accurate or may be original research. Prince of Thieves (talk) 19:37, 2 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]
• Comment to the closer - please consider WP:TNT approach to this OR mess. Renata (talk) 17:27, 3 March 2018 (UTC)[reply]

The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.